Class is in session. Interdependent Study is about the learning and unlearning work for social justice and collective liberation. Interdependent Study is hosted by Damien Franze, an angry Black man from Baltimore who wears his heart on his sleeve, and Aaron Hood, an angry white man from Florida who is always thinking. We’re two friends who work in education and share a commitment to social justice. We believe that we are always learning; always arriving. People constantly learn and unlearn b ...
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What if we represented ourselves?
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There is great hope and potential in the possibility of us truly representing ourselves through direct democracy. Listen as Aaron and Damien discuss the piece “The Potential Benefits of Direct Democracy and Voting for Policies, Not Personalities” by Olúfẹ́mi O. Táíwò in Hammer & Hope, which analyzes the concept of direct democracy as a powerful and…
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Solidarity Beyond the Crises
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The connections between Black and Palestinian liberation struggles are clear and present now more than ever. Listen as Aaron and Damien discuss the piece “Black-Palestinian Solidarity in Moments of Crisis and Beyond” by Nashwa Bawab in In These Times, which features an interview with four incredible activists—Eman Abdelhadi, Calvin John Smiley, San…
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Mass Criminalization as Religion
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There is so much to learn about the religious underpinnings and functions of the mass criminalization of Black, Indigenous, and marginalized communities. Listen as Aaron and Damien discuss the book White Property, Black Trespass: Racial Capitalism and the Religious Function of Mass Criminalization by Andrew Krinks, which analyzes the existence and …
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Interdependent Dialogue #3
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We’ve got a special episode this week! Listen as Aaron and Damien engage in a dialogue activity using The Skin Deep’s {THE AND} On Racism Edition tool and have a special conversation about their personal thoughts and reflections on a wide range of social justice issues. Follow us on social media and visit our website! Patreon…
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Shedding Delusions of Individualism
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June Jordan’s experiences and writings about censorship and dissent still apply today. Listen as Aaron and Damien discuss the piece “June Jordan on Palestine and American Delusions” in In These Times, which features an introduction by Sherell Barbee. This piece features excerpts of June Jordan’s essay “Life After Lebanon” (1984), which is a reflect…
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The Perils of Racism & Fascism
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The perils of fascism are a danger to our ability to reach the North Star of liberation. Listen as Aaron and Damien discuss the piece “Toni Morrison on Fascism and Censorship” in In These Times, which features an introduction by Sherell Barbee. This piece features reprints of Toni Morrison’s essays “Peril” (2008) and “Racism and Fascism” (1995), wh…
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Transformative Justice Around the World
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Abolition and community-based responses to harm are critical to our collective liberation. Listen as Aaron and Damien discuss the resource “Transformative Justice Knows No Borders: Learning from Community-Based Responses to Harm Around the World” by Melanie Brazzell and published by Interrupting Criminalization, which shares lessons learned from th…
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The 1985 MOVE bombing in Philadelphia was a stunning and tragic incident and violation of civil and human rights. Listen as Aaron and Damien discuss the documentary Let the Fire Burn: Tragedy in Philadelphia (directed and produced by Jason Osder), which is a found-footage film that chronicles the longtime feud between the city of Philadelphia and t…
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Abolition, #defund, and the work and fight for collective liberation are necessary in order to build a better world for all of us. Listen as Aaron and Damien discuss the book Defund: Conversations toward Abolition by Calvin John Smiley, which is a collection of conversations between Smiley and several abolitionist organizers and leaders reflecting …
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Louisiana's Fascist Creep
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As the general election approaches, what’s happening in Louisiana is a testing ground for repressive, fascist legislation and oppression. Listen as Aaron and Damien discuss the piece “Louisiana is the blueprint for further fascist repression” by Gabrielle A. Perry in Scalawag, which outlines and analyzes the impact of some of the alarming fascist l…
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The Uncommitted Movement is strong, committed, and not going anywhere. Listen as Aaron and Damien discuss the piece “Spurned by the DNC, the Uncommitted Movement Staged a Sit-in” by Eman Abdelhadi in In These Times, which analyzes the Democratic National Convention’s decision to refuse to allow a vetted speech by a Palestinian to be given on the DN…
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Strategy in Protests & Polarization
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Protests are often an effective tool as part of any strategy for social movements. Listen as Aaron and Damien discuss the pieces “Why protests work, even when not everybody likes them” and “How to make sure your disruptive protest helps your cause” by Mark Engler and Paul Engler in Waging Nonviolence, which outline how movements can understand and …
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Anti-Apartheid Organizing on Campus
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There are many similarities between student organizing and protests against South African apartheid in the 1980s and the student organizing and protests against the genocide in Palestine today. Listen as Aaron and Damien discuss a piece in Hammer & Hope titled “My Time Organizing on Campus Against Apartheid in South Africa” by Barbara Ransby, which…
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Borders, Necropolitics, and Solidarity
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Palestinian resistance is connected to all struggles for peace and liberation around the world. Listen as Aaron and Damien discuss the book Their Borders, Our World: Building New Solidarities with Palestine, edited by Mahdi Sabbagh, which is a collection of essays that connect Palestinian resistance with global freedom struggles against settler col…
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“Building skilled, coordinated, expansive, and robust ecosystems of collective care is only becoming more and more essential to our collective survival.” Listen as Aaron and Damien discuss “Mapping Community Ecosystems of Collective Care”, an Interrupting Criminalization toolkit written by Shannon Perez-Darby and Andrea J. Ritchie, which provides r…
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Displacement, Gentrification, and Barry Farm
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“The evolution of US cities always happens on the back of Black communities.” Listen as Aaron and Damien discuss the documentary Barry Farm: Community, Land & Justice in Washington, DC, directed by Sabiyha Prince and Samuel George, which chronicles the history of the African American community known as Barry Farm, as well as the lives of its genera…
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Campus Protest Crackdowns
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The organizing and civil disobedience taking place on college campuses across the country is not going away anytime soon. Listen as Aaron and Damien discuss the piece "The Crackdown on Campus Protests is Just Beginning" by Adam Federman in In These Times, which highlights and analyzes how higher education institutions across the country have change…
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Decolonization as a Path to Collective Liberation
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There’s so much to learn from history, especially Indigenous history and movements, in our present day activism and fight for collective liberation. Listen as Aaron and Damien discuss the piece “Indigenous Resistance is Post-Apocalyptic”, which is a discussion between Nick Serpe and Nick Estes about Estes’ book Our History Is The Future about the c…
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A Love Letter to Abolition
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“Prison abolition is not a fad, any more than it is a distant, utopian farce. It is a practical organizing praxis that is making a difference today.” Listen as Aaron and Damien discuss the book How To Abolish Prisons: Lessons from the Movement Against Imprisonment by Rachel Herzing and Justin Piché, which examines the evolution, strategies, and wor…
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Return the Black Hills to the Lakota
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The Lakota tribe continues to fight to protect their sacred land in the Black Hills to this day. Listen as Aaron and Damien discuss the documentary Lakota Nation vs. United States, directed by Jesse Short Bull and Laura Tomaselli, which chronicles the history and lived experiences of the Lakota tribe and Indigenous communities in the United States …
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Create a Real Social Safety Net
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We need to do all we can to eliminate poverty in this country. Listen as Aaron and Damien discuss the piece “The Rise of Poverty Inc." by Anne Kim in The Atlantic, which explores how poverty and helping the poor has become big business in the United States, and “Places across the U.S. are testing no-strings cash as part of the social safety net" by…
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Transformative Solidarity Part 2
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The book Solidarity: The Past, Present, and Future of a World-Changing Idea ends with the statement: “Solidarity is the only thing that can save us.” Listen as Aaron and Damien discuss the second half of the book Solidarity: The Past, Present, and Future of a World-Changing Idea by Leah Hunt-Hendrix and Astra Taylor, which surveys and analyzes how …
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Transformative Solidarity Part 1
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Transformative solidarity is a powerful strategy that can be helpful in our fight for social change. Listen as Aaron and Damien discuss the first half of the book Solidarity: The Past, Present, and Future of a World-Changing Idea by Leah Hunt-Hendrix and Astra Taylor, which surveys and analyzes how transformative solidarity has been used around the…
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Public Health & Abolition
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We must continue to fight for a public health system that centers abolition in its efforts for the health and well-being of all of us. Listen as Aaron and Damien discuss the piece “For the People’s Health” by Cristian Farias in Inquest, which analyzes how and why abolition and public health must go hand in hand and outlines some examples of aboliti…
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Humanitarian Crisis in Sudan
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The war in Sudan that’s been taking place for the past year is a crisis that is not getting enough news coverage. Listen as Aaron and Damien discuss the piece “Sudan’s conflict hits the 1-year mark, sparking fears of repeated atrocities” by Kate Bartlett in NPR and an episode of The Listening Post on Al Jazeera called “Sudan: A savage war and toxic…
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Angela Davis Teaches us about Palestinian Solidarity
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There will be no justice for any of us unless there is justice for the Palestinian people. Listen as Aaron and Damien discuss the piece “Angela Davis: Standing with Palestinians” by Angela Davis in Hammer & Hope, which shares her brilliant reflections on the past 60+ years of the state of Israel and Palestine’s relationship with one another and the…
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Authoritarian Restrictions on Protesting
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We must protect all of our rights, especially our right to protest, at all costs. Listen as Aaron and Damien discuss the piece “The War on Protest” by Adam Federman in In These Times, which analyzes the recent rise in political repression and the government’s criminalization of dissent, protest, and social movements, and what we learn and take away…
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Emergent Strategies & Abolition
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We all deserve to live in a world where we collectively have everything we need to live and thrive. Listen as Aaron and Damien discuss the book Practicing New Worlds: Abolition and Emergent Strategies by Andrea J. Ritchie, which analyzes the concept of emergent strategies and current abolitionist practices and explores how emergent strategies can h…
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Abolition in Real Time: Healing & Justice Center
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Community-based public safety is essential to providing our communities and people with the resources they need to live and thrive. Listen as Aaron and Damien discuss the Healing and Justice Center’s 2023 Annual Report, which outlines the organization’s efforts to enact true community-based public safety initiatives in Miami, and what we learn from…
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Dr. King as a Moral Compass on Palestine
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We must have the courage to stand up for what’s right regarding Palestine. Listen as Aaron and Damien discuss the piece “The Courage to Disagree” by Derecka Purnell in Hammer & Hope, which analyzes how Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr.'s words and beliefs have been used by leaders and politicians to advance their own social and political agendas, especia…
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Here's a brief solo episode from Aaron where he discusses the targeted bombings of the World Central Kitchen staff members, the man-made famine, and continuing to take action for a ceasefire and for freedom for Palestinians. Jewish Voice for Peace A-15 Economic Blockade World Central Kitchen Follow us on social media and visit our website! Patreon…
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Rehearsing for the Next World
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We must figure out what liberation could look like so everyone can live the life they deserve. Listen as Aaron and Damien discuss the book Rehearsals for Living by Robyn Maynard and Leanne Betasamosake Simpson, which compiles letters written by the authors to each other analyzing the histories, lived experiences, and struggles of Black and Indigeno…
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While there is a constant demand for civility in our society, we must understand the impact that civil disobedience can and should play in our fight for collective liberation. Listen as Aaron and Damien discuss the piece “The Limits of Civil Disobedience” by Keyvan Golsorkhi in Non-Profit Quarterly, which explores and analyzes the roles that civil …
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Invest/Divest: Bringing Everyone Along to Abolition
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Understanding the perspectives of Black Americans on community safety, policing, and the criminal punishment system is paramount to the fight for abolition. Listen as Aaron and Damien discuss a report from the Movement for Black Lives and GenForward called “Perspectives on Community Safety from Black America”, which shares and analyzes the results …
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The Left’s fight against the Right in 2024 (and beyond) is a battle that must be won. Listen as Aaron and Damien discuss a piece from In These Times called “The Right is Prepared For This Moment. Are We?”, which features a conversation with Jamelle Bouie, Alex Han, Nancy MacLean, Tarso Luís Ramos, and Olúfẹ́mi O. Táíwò about the Left's role in figh…
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None of us are free until we are all free. Listen as Aaron and Damien discuss a piece titled “When Abolitionists Say ‘Free Them All,’ We Mean Palestine Too” by Nadine Naber in Truthout, which argues that the fight for abolition and the fight for Palestinian liberation are one and the same and the clear connections that exist between the systems and…
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Beyond Nations. Beyond Maps.
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The ongoing fight against capitalism and white supremacism requires radical Black anarchism. Listen as Aaron and Damien discuss the book The Nation on No Map: Black Anarchism and Abolition by William C. Anderson, which explores state power, abolition, and ideological tensions within the struggle for Black liberation while centering the politics of …
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Racist Ideas Are Stamped On Us
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Racism, white supremacy, and anti-Blackness are baked into the fabric of this country. Listen as Aaron and Damien discuss the documentary “Stamped From The Beginning”, which is based on Ibram X. Kendi’s book by the same name and explores the history of racist ideas and myths in the United States, and what we learn and take away from this incredible…
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Family Policing Abolition
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Abolitionist organizing must include a focus on abolishing family policing as part of its work. Listen as Aaron and Damien discuss a piece called “No More Family Policing” by Eleanor J. Bader in Inquest, which explores family policing in the context of our criminal punishment, education, and social services systems, and what we learn from this incr…
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Palestine Laboratory: Israel's Occupation Exported
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The power, reach, and legacy of Israel's military industrial complex is immense. Listen as Aaron and Damien discuss the book The Palestine Laboratory: How Israel Exports the Technology of Occupation Around the World by Antony Loewenstein, which presents and explores a historical summary of how Israel has developed a world-class military industrial …
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Beyond Carceral Responses
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We must build community resources, interventions, and support that do not rely on the carceral system. Listen as Aaron and Damien discuss a resource guide by Shira Hassan and Interrupting Criminalization called “Painting the Ocean & the Sky”, which provides guidance to abolitionist activists, organizers, and leaders on best practices for building c…
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Race & Class Intersections
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It is important to understand the complexity of class and race and how they can interact in such a way that becomes a barrier to progress. Listen as Aaron and Damien discuss the piece “Black Class Matters” by Keeanga-Yamahtta Taylor in Hammer & Hope, which explores the intersections and implications of class and race for Black Americans in politics…
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Reverse Migration & Black Political Power
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The great migration in reverse theory is a compelling idea for Black Americans to consider. Listen as Aaron and Damien discuss the documentary South to Black Power, which follows author and op-ed journalist Charles M. Blow as he explores the great migration in reverse theory as a strategy for Black Americans to move south and gain greater political…
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2023 is almost wrapped so it’s time for our last episode of the year! Listen as Aaron and Damien reflect on the past year of our podcast, and each share our top 5 moments from the show. Thank you for listening to Interdependent Study! We’ll see you in 2024! Follow us on social media and visit our website! Website, Instagram…
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Abolition: How do we get there from here? Part 2
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Our conversation about the many questions that abolitionist organizers need to answer in order to create the future we need continues. Listen as Aaron and Damien discuss a ‘zine by Interrupting Criminalization called “Abolition & the State: Responses Vol. 1”, which engages abolitionists and scholars in sharing their reflections on the questions rai…
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Abolition: How do we get there from here?
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There are many questions that abolitionist organizers need to answer in order to create the future we need. Listen as Aaron and Damien discuss a discussion tool by Interrupting Criminalization called “Abolition & the State”, which provides questions and activities for abolitionist organizers to use to explore the possibilities for moving beyond exi…
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Fight For The Whole Working Class
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Class struggle unionism can serve as a way to rebuild a powerful labor movement in this country. Listen as Aaron and Damien discuss the book Class Struggle Unionism by Joe Burns, which shares the history and characteristics of unionism and outlines ideas common to class struggle unionism and how these ideas can create a more militant, democratic, a…
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Reconstruction Continues
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The vision and legacy of Reconstruction in this country continues today. Listen as Aaron and Damien discuss the piece “How Black Americans Kept Reconstruction Alive” by Peniel E. Joseph in The Atlantic, which shares how Black Reconstructionists created and enacted a vision for a multiracial democracy that continues now through the work of abolition…
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Abolition Here, There, and Everywhere
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Abolitionist organizing work is taking place everywhere in this country. Listen as Aaron and Damien discuss the piece “Abolition Everywhere” by Meghan Krausch in Inquest, which explores some of the abolitionist organizing taking place in Republican-controlled states and regions across the country, particularly in the south, and what we learn and ta…
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Health Justice: More than Do No Harm
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Abolitionist organizing for health justice is important and necessary work. Listen as Aaron and Damien discuss the piece “Beyond Do No Harm: Health Justice and Abolition” by Maria Thomas in The Forge, which outlines the mission and recent work of the Beyond Do No Harm Network and introduces their 13 principles for health care providers to interrupt…
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